Erroneous claim that Islam will be the center of the last antichrist

Joel Richardson is betting on Islam raising the last antichrist. That is not Biblical. Jesus of Mecca has come in flesh, but Islam denies his divinity.

Mecca already have a false Jesus as their prohect. A mortal man of flesh.
Mecca already have a false Jesus as their prohect. A mortal man of flesh.

The question of the last antichrist is a debate that has gone on for the last 2000 years. The last person to throw in a fireball, is Joel Richardson. His book «The Islamic Antichrist» has already become a bestseller.

Without reading the book, by media commentators and bloggers, I can say that the book seems to have serious errors.

A bestseller with errors that bail out Rome
A bestseller with errors that bail out Rome

Let me first say that there is a Islamic Messianic movement around the 12 Imam. This sect is powerful, since the Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a member. But the 12 Imam is not even Jesus, the Islamic prophet.

The 12 Imam is the spiritual head of a dooms day cult, and can never become mainstream Islam, and capable of deceiving billions of Muslims, Catholics and carnal Christians to follow a Universal One World religion.

On of the errors is bailing the Roman Empire out of their responsibility of destroying the Jewish Temple in 70 A.D. To say that it was people from the Middle East who did this, is a copy-cat maneuver from the Nuremberg trials after World War II: The German officers tried to plead not guilty, claiming that they were only obeying orders from a higher officer and generals.

Yes, its possible that the men of local governors and kings did the physical damage to Jerusalem and the temple. But the legal and de facto responsibility will forever lay with Emperor Titus in Rome. Whatever he overlooked the carnage or not in the Roman province.

Second error:

Richardson claim that the final antichrist will not come from Rome, but from a Muslim nation. And that the nations under the rule of Antichrist will be nations controlled by Islam. That the US and Europe either will be controlled by Islam, or that they will be excluded from the rule of antichrist, is fiction. But a joint new Universal religion that includes Islam will rule both in Washington, London and Paris.

Islam already have a Jesus, who they claim have already have come in flesh. «Jesus of Mecca» is a prophet, a mortal man. That is not the spirit of antichrist. The final antichrist will claim to be God. The Catholic «Jesus of Rome» is a perfect candidate that can unite. He is already represented by a pope who bear the name of God of the Bible. «The Holy Father».

The Pope only have to shift his papal throne from Rome to Jerusalem, than the Vatican has fulfilled the prophecies about antichrist and his religious system. It is more likely that the final antichrist will rule after a joint bid from Washington, Mecca and Rome. Its more easy to unite all copies of the real Jesus around the Papal «Jesus». On a false agenda of World peace they will all become corrupt, compromise and bend the truth.

Joel Richardson
Joel Richardson

Third error:

Richardson claim that Rome can not be Babylon, since the Roman Empire never conquered the city of Babylon. This is a misunderstanding. To the rather radical opposite, it was Babylon who conquered the Vatican. We are not talking about a physical occupation, but a spiritual battle lost . The demons behind the idols for Babylon entered into the idols of Rome. Banned by the Bible, but permitted by the Pontiff and the church he is the head of.

Be careful Brethren. We are living in the age of deceptions. Islam will surely become part of the reign of antichrist, but so will both Italy and USA.

Read how the US president is making a bid to unite Islam and Christianity: Click here

83 thoughts on “Erroneous claim that Islam will be the center of the last antichrist

  1. Whatever the “errors,” the attack on Islam is based on hate and ignorance. That, is quite clear. While Muslims do believe in Jesus, the man, born miraculously by the Will of God, Jews do not even acknowledge him in any shape, way or form. So why isn’t THAT mentioned, I wonder!

    12 Imams? Is this a Shia sect specific claim? If so, the generalization is ludicrous! Islam has no “12 Imams.” Period!

    ATW

    1. Dear ATW.

      Shalom, good to see you back on this site.

      What you are trying to tell me is a half-truth. In Israel, there is around 20.000 Jews who publicly confess Jesus as the Messiah. In the USA, there are now more than 200.000 Messianic Jews. When it come to the Jews who have obeyed a Messiah, that they do not know by name, by returning to Zion: An opinion poll in Israel showed that 46 per cent of the Jews now believe that there is a Messiah, and that He will come.

      And I can give you a promise that is the truth. He will come. When the Jews cry out in pain over being persecuted by all kinds of religious people, He is coming in the clouds of Heaven, with full power and glory. Next, He will make a touch down on the Month of Olives in Jerusalem, and separate the wicked from the children of God. Amen.

      All Jews will that day say: Blessed is He who comes in the name of God the Almighty.

      1. 46 per cent of the Jews now believe that there is a Messiah, and that He will come.

        Very clever ivarfjeld, very clever.

        In the Jewish faith there IS a Messiah returning – but Jews do not consider Jesus to be the one. Orthodox Jews claim that Jesus is a deceptive, dishonorable and liar that he is boiling the excerment in Hell.

        Meanwhile, Muslims do believe that Jesus IS coming back: and the first thing he will do is BREAK the cross – for he was never crucified as his 12 disciples also agreed – kill the pig – as he will say that he ordered his followers not to eat the swine or any of its derivatives and finally kill the anti-Christ as well as be involved in a fight against the Jews who do not accept him and did not accept him – or proclaimed that they had killed/ crucified him.

        And I promise you that THIS IS the TRUTH! Jesus worshiped God, the Magnificent, the Omnipotent. This is clear in your Bible when he supposedly stated, on the “cross:” Eli, Eli, lama sbachtani?

        ATW

      2. Dear ATW.

        Shalom.

        I am impressed that you know more about the Bible, than I know about the Quran. But be careful. I am a fast learner.

        You justed confessed in your writings, that Jesus is coming back. Well, that an astonishing revelation from a Muslim. Because what you just confirmed is that Jesus is divine. He was not only a prophet, and a mortal man.

        Now, what would be the reason for His return from His heavenly glory?

        You say that He will kill the anti-Christ.

        Welcome to the truth that is revealed in the Holy Bible. Since you also believe in the anti-christ, you have to ask your self another question:

        – Is it an anti-christ who is the king in your own heart? Because Jesus said: «Love one another, like I have loved you». To proclaim hate and violent, I guess that is the work of the anti-christ?

      3. ivar,

        Confessed? This is what Muslims believe! All Sunni Muslims at least. “Eesa,” peace be upon him – who in English you call Jesus, is definitely coming back.

        And Jesus is coming back because at that time it would be the End of Times: he was never crucified and God saved him from the Jews and Romans.

        As for the “truth” my friend, the Truth is in the Islamic Faith: the faith of Abraham and every single prophet INCLUDING Jesus.

        Hate? Funny, most Christians claim to love “others” yet they are the first to attack Jews or Muslims as non-believers. Compare that to what the Quran says about Christians:

        5:82 Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, “We are Christians”: because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.

        ATW

      4. Dear ATW

        You wrote:

        Hate? Funny, most Christians claim to love “others” yet they are the first to attack Jews or Muslims as non-believers. Compare that to what the Quran says about Christians:

        My reply:

        Here we agree. Claimed to be Christians who have attacked Jews or Muslims are false Christians. One of them is the Pope of Rome, who have used the Catholic faith even to get Christians burnt at stake.

        I hope you agree that Muslims that attack Jews and Christians are false Muslims?

      5. Ivar,

        If a Muslim kills anyone – regardless of religion or belief – for no reason, it is as if he killed Mankind! So does the Quran states. However, don’t go attacking Islam because Arab Muslims AND Arab Christians defend their lands: as in Palestine! Resisting occupation from the filth and terror of Zionism is a God’s given right!

        ATW

      6. Dear ATW.

        Shalom, and love in Jesus who are in Heaven.

        Yes, it is correct, that one version of the Talmud says that Jesus is in Hell. But you your self, says that Jesus will come back. So not even you believe what this version of the Talmud says is the truth. The Bible says that many Jews will not recognize the Messiah before He comes back. I guess this verse in the Talmud is an example of the truth Jesus has spoken?

        If the Orthodox Jews would except Jesus as the Messiah before the return of the Messiah, than Jesus of the Bible would be a false prophet. He is not. Even the Orthodox Jewish rejection of Him has been foretold by the Messiah.

        Are the Orthodox Jews the only one who have rejected him? Does the Messiah still love them?

        Absolutely.

        I did not only reject Him. I crucified Him. It was my sins that drove Him to the cross. I deserve to die, and go to Hell. But because he loves as sinner like me, I have been saved. Saved by the blood of Jesus. This salvation is also available for you, ATW. As it is available for all Orthodox Jews.

      7. You insist that Jesus is God? Glory be to God the Almighty from what you claim!

        But as stated before and you never addressed: why does Jesus cry on the cross to his God and say: Eli, Eli, lama sabachtani? Strange, isn’t it?

        3:55 Behold! Allah said: “O JESUS! I will take thee and raise thee to Myself and clear thee (of the falsehoods) of those who blaspheme; I will make those who follow thee superior to those who reject faith, to the Day of Resurrection: Then shall ye all return unto me, and I will judge between you of the matters wherein ye dispute.

        And another thing: you claim that the Bible is Holy yet 50 of your priests when they gathered to determine how holy the Bible was, determined that it was not the word of God and really the word of men – nothing miraculous about it and narrated as if someone is telling a story – and that it has changed many times over the years. This is (was) in the preface of the RSV Bible.

        Of the 27 books of the New Testament, only a fraction of the words are attributed to Jesus. How then is the book Holy?

        Consider the Songs of Solomon – very “holy, right?”
        Or the story of the birth of Jesus and how Mary, peace be upon her, became pregnant with Jesus! It’s unfit to be included in a “holy” book!

        In comparison, read the Quran (fast learner) and see the difference in the story and how divine it is.

        You see, Muslims believe that Jesus is Holy and was created miraculously and without a father – Joseph! He walked on water and cured the sick and performed other miracles ALL IN THE NAME OF and permission of GOD! He spoke immediately after his birth to comfort his mother! Yet most Christians don’t believe this AND choose to believe he is God?

        He never claimed to be God, son of God, one of three or so forth.

        ATW

      8. Ivar,

        I did not only reject Him. I crucified Him. It was my sins that drove Him to the cross. I deserve to die, and go to Hell. But because he loves as sinner like me, I have been saved. Saved by the blood of Jesus. This salvation is also available for you, ATW. As it is available for all Orthodox Jews.

        Pardon? Let me ask this very simple question: if you have children and one of them steals, for example, would one of your other siblings go to jail for the thief?

        What kind of God is it that makes you sinful eternally? And if you have been SAVED, then why would you children not be saved at birth? Ironic!

        Muslims believe in a Merciful God; one who answers prayers directly! He loves us so much THAT He wants us to pray to Him and ask for His Mercy and Rewards. He is so merciful that even Satan, on the Day of Judgment will witness such Mercy and will hope that God will forgive him!

        ATW

      9. Dear ATW..

        Shalom.

        You wrote:

        What kind of God is it that makes you sinful eternally?

        My comment:

        Sin is everything that is not yet inside the Kingdom of Heaven. I guess that why Allah will not permit you to enter. When we sin, we sin against God. Only the blood of Jesus, God the Son, can cleanse you from you sins.

      10. Ivar,

        You just respond for the sake of responding! You dance around the issue and present nothing half-convincing! The crucifixion according to Christians was so that your sins are wiped out! My question again, is why did the god you worship, the one who loves everyone, create you with a sin to begin with, then commit the violent act of killing “his” son?

        Pretty strange, isn’t it?

        ATW

      11. Dear ATW.

        Shalom, which means peace.

        Your comment:

        My question again, is why did the god you worship, the one who loves everyone, create you with a sin to begin with, then commit the violent act of killing “his” son?

        My reply:

        God your Father did not create you with sin. The first man sinned, and God our Father cursed His creation. Since that day all men, Muslims, Christians and Jews have been under a curse and separated from a Holy and just Father. Just take a look outside your own window, and you will see all the wickedness his creation is indulging in. Hate, crime, violence, stealing, robbing, to mention some few things.

        Now, how do we escape the Wrath of God? The truth is that no man can escape the wickedness grafted into our evil hearts. All have sinned, and have fallen short of the glory of God. We all deserve nothing but eternal death in Hell. Separated from Our Father, or Allah whom you chose to call him.

        Now the good news: God Him self came down from Heaven, and set up His tent among us. He walked among us, in the form of a human. Completely human. He shared our pain, and even cried. Why did he come? Because all had gone astray, and needed a new heart, and a fresh beginning. This man was born and raised a Jew. His name was Jesus. He gave up His life for us, only to take His life back. Death could not handle Him. The Grave could not hold him. Now, He invites you to become His best friend…..

      12. Dear ATW

        Peace be with you:

        You wrote:

        «on the Day of Judgment will witness such Mercy and will hope that God will forgive him!»

        My comment:

        This is the difference between Jesus, only a Prophet, and Jesus God the Son.Your Jesus only a prophet can not save you from your sins. He could not even save him self. When you accept my Jesus as God the Son, you do not have to hope that your sins will be forgiven. They are already forgiven. 2000 years ago.

        You do not longer have to wait till after you die, to find out if Allah will show you mercy. God of the Bible has already pardoned your sins, and will remember them no more. Because Jesus has payed for them all.

  2. If I may shed a little light on this as far as Babylon
    goes. Go to Jeremiah 27:6 Nebuchadnezzar was King of Babylon. When I looked up Nebuchadnezzar it stated and you will have to forgive me for this as it was awhile back, Necuchadnezzar was king of either Irac or Iran. For those of you who want to look that up to see which one go ahead, I do not have the time right now. Anyways this is the mighty army God sent. I believe the Bible said this army came from the north.

    So when I read this I took Babylon to be which ever one of this countries he came from. Again forgive me for not knowing, but the older I get the thing I miss the most is my mind:>)

    Just some FYI. God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      From India with love. Thanks for this comment. But I have to confess I was not fully able to understand what you were trying to tell us.

    2. Wow it shows how dumb some people are….yapping like crazy and then they don’t even have facts that make sense…once you mention Iran or Irac (the way the babyling dumb ass wrote it) you know this man is simply pulling facts from his little hat that he has heard over the years. the end of the day you people are all idiots cause most of you Muslim < Jew or Christian all yap about your great religions yet you let the rich hijack not only your beliefs but your country and we pay for the wars they create and only the rich get richer while we fund their crap. Who cares who is right….isn't GOD the ultimate judge and if you believe in God and the yearafter then why does fighting now really matter cause when he comes let that judgement stand. But the loser will obvioulsy not sit by idoly but that is just the nature of dumb human. We are all pathetic worrying about crap while people starve….while people are killed fo ohters to further their agendas and in most cases it comes down to wealth and power….why do you think the Vatican outlawed priest to get married…cause with no KIN the monye goes to the Vatican…it was a changed to help fund the Vatican in the 10the centruy but like income tax the once temporary tax became permanent.

  3. I might have misunderstood you, but I thought you were saying “Rome” was Babylon, since you referred to the Pope shifting his papal throne from Rome to Jerusalem. Like again this may be a mis-read on my part and if so, I apologize.

    Being that this army God sent was north of Judah, and Nebuchadnezzar was the king of this country, Rome could not be Babylon. Does India set north of Judah, as I do not know? Geography is not one of my greatest strong points.

    Again sorry if I mis-read, but maybe you can tell me what you meant if I did. God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      If you read the article carefully, you will see that i claim that Babylon captured Rome. Not physically, but Spiritually.

      Many might smile at me for telling that a future Pope (we have to wait and see) will shift the Papal throne from Rome to Jerusalem. But faithful and observant Catholics will not find that so unlikely.

      If you google «Jerusalem mother church», you will find an article from 1997:

      THE MOTHER CHURCH OF JERUSALEM CELEBRATES EASTER UNDER SIEGE …. During this Easter celebration the Patriarch of Jerusalem proclaimed a message for the….

      I guess a Church under siege, must one day be liberated?

  4. The king of errors spouts more errors…Rome is not Babylon. Holy Father does not claim to be Christ or God. Holy Father will not and cannot move to Jerusalem.

    Your understanding of the Apocalypse is erroneous or possibly just focused on one single aspect of the many deep meanings.

    1. David.

      You are a hard nut to crack, because you are full of pride, and do not want to understand. Even if the Catholics had not claimed that the Pope is infallible in disputes about moral issues, and understanding of the scripture, there is a limit for what kind of names you can give the Pontiff.

      God reserve the name «Holy Father» for him self. It was the name which Jesus addressed His Father in Heaven. And only Him.

      John 17:11
      Now I am no longer in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to You. Holy Father, keep through Your name those whom You have given Me, that they may be one as We are.

      1. No pride here, Ivar, just humility. But when I see error, I try to educate. Your statement from John 17:1, what version of the Bible are you using? That phrase is not in any of the 10 bible translations I have, including the Greek Interlinear. It simply states “Father”. Even so, there’s a wide gap between our Holy Father in heaven and our Holy Father on earth. The Pope knows his place, and he does not proclaim himself Holy Father. His usual proclaimation for himself is “Servant of the Servants of God.”

      2. David.

        You were forgiven 2000 years ago. Now, change your ways. I sincerely want to meet you, also in the Kingdom of Heaven.

  5. Okay I understand what you are saying now. Will look up article later have a house to clean. Hey David.

    Ya’ll take care and yes I am from Texas, so I can say ya.ll. God Bless, Sandy

  6. “Richardson claims the AntiChrist will not come from Rome but a Muslim Nation” “Richardson claims Rome cannot be Babylon”

    I think this is the temple the author was referring to but do not know as I have not read the book either:

    According to Scripture Jerusalem had two temples. One destroyed by Nebuchadnezzar in 586BC from Babylon.
    “Babylonia was a state in Lower Mesopotamia (Iraq) with Babylon as it’s capital.
    see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Temple then click on first and second temple.

    The second temple destroyed in 70AD was destroyed by the Roman Empire, you are correct.

    The remains of Babylon can be found today in Iraq.

    So according to Scripture the geographical area of Babylon was in Iraq and not Rome.

    This is what was throwing me off this morning, as I knew the first Temple in Jerusalem had been destroyed by those in Iraq. At that time in Scripture it was called “Babylon.”

    So as far as my personal beliefs, I do not believe “Babylon” is in Rome either. But that is me.
    If we are still here we will see what happens I guess.

    Have a good day mine is about to end. God Bless, Sandy P.S. Now I know what you meant by “India.” I know a couple from there and they are very nice people. Love them and their family to death. They are Hindu’s. It was very interesting to learn some of their religion. (Not that I agree so do not blast me off of the earth now:>) Goodnight.

  7. The Pope calling himself “God” by use of the term “Holy Father.” Let’s go to Scripture with this, because taken out of context this is exactly what it means. I am going to give a few Sciptures the rest everyone can go and look up.

    The Word Holy: Ex. 3:5 We have holy ground. Ex. 30:25 We have holy ointment and holy annointing oil. Ex. 16:23 The Sabbath is Holy. Ex. 22:31 “And ye shall be holy men unto me. Numbers 5:17 We have holy water. Men are also called to be holy in all that we do. The Ancient Prophets were holy men of God. So the word Holy can be applied to many things in the Bible, men in included.

    The Word Father: Cannot be used because it is calling someone God? Let us go to the Bible. Gen. 17:4 God said Himself to Abraham, “for I am making you the father of host of many nations. Gen. 26:24 God says, “I am the God of Abraham thy father.” God Himself called our earthly fathers (Father) Honor thy father and mother. Let us go to the NT. Mt. 8:21 “me first to go and bury my father.” Mt. 19:5 “This cause shall a man leave “father.” There are many more but then in Mt. 23:9 we are told, “Call no man father upon earth.” Seems to contradict here doesn’t it? But we know the Bible cannot contradict itself. Now we have to make sense out of it don’t we? This is what happens when one Scripture is given, the overall of it does not come through.

    I will take it everyone knows what holy means. Let us go to the Hebrew meaning of “Father.” It means without giving all the language use, “Chief.” Now let us go to the words “Lord” in Hebrew. “From an unused root meaning “rule” “soverign” “controller” human or divine Lord master owner. We see right here the word “Lord” can be applied to the human or divine. The English have “lords.”

    So let us put it together. We call the Pope “Holy Father” because he is deemed as a holy man. Nothing wrong with that according to Scripture. We call him “Father” because he is the “Chief” of the Catholic Church. Nothing wrong with calling men “father” on earth as we can see in Scripture. God did it Himself. Lord can be used for human and divine according to Hebrew text. Now we are left with the Scripture where we call no one father on earth, yet we saw it was done in many scriptures.

    What this means is: We never call anyone holy, father, lord, with the same reverence that we give to God. To see it any other way will be making the Bible contradict itself and it does not. There have always been “holy men of God” The term “father” has always been used, and lord can apply to the human or the divine. In calling the Pope Holy Father all that is meant is he is a holy man of God, the Chief of the Catholic Church. This is not a sin according to Scripture.

    1. Dear Sandy.

      Good to see that your Holy Father in Heaven woke you up this morning….

      Matthew 23:9
      And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven.

      1. First, as we’ve seen, the imperative “call no man father” does not apply to one’s biological father. It also doesn’t exclude calling one’s ancestors “father,” as is shown in Acts 7:2, where Stephen refers to “our father Abraham,” or in Romans 9:10, where Paul speaks of “our father Isaac.”

        Second, there are numerous examples in the New Testament of the term “father” being used as a form of address and reference, even for men who are not biologically related to the speaker. There are, in fact, so many uses of “father” in the New Testament, that the Fundamentalist interpretation of Matthew 23 (and the objection to Catholics calling priests “father”) must be wrong, as we shall see.

        Third, a careful examination of the context of Matthew 23 shows that Jesus didn’t intend for his words here to be understood literally. The whole passage reads, “But you are not to be called ‘rabbi,’ for you have one teacher, and you are all brethren. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven. Neither be called ‘masters,’ for you have one master, the Christ” (Matt. 23:8–10).

        The first problem is that although Jesus seems to prohibit the use of the term “teacher,” in Matthew 28:19–20, Christ himself appointed certain men to be teachers in his Church: “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations . . . teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you.” Paul speaks of his commission as a teacher: “For this I was appointed a preacher and apostle . . . a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth” (1 Tim. 2:7); “For this gospel I was appointed a preacher and apostle and teacher” (2 Tim. 1:11). He also reminds us that the Church has an office of teacher: “God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers” (1 Cor. 12:28); and “his gifts were that some should be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, some pastors and teachers” (Eph. 4:11). There is no doubt that Paul was not violating Christ’s teaching in Matthew 23 by referring so often to others as “teachers.”

        Fundamentalists themselves slip up on this point by calling all sorts of people “doctor,” for example, medical doctors, as well as professors and scientists who have Ph.D. degrees (i.e., doctorates). What they fail to realize is that “doctor” is simply the Latin word for “teacher.” Even “Mister” and “Mistress” (“Mrs.”) are forms of the word “master,” also mentioned by Jesus. So if his words in Matthew 23 were meant to be taken literally, Fundamentalists would be just as guilty for using the word “teacher” and “doctor” and “mister” as Catholics for saying “father.” But clearly, that would be a misunderstanding of Christ’s words.

        Jesus criticized Jewish leaders who love “the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues, and salutations in the market places, and being called ‘rabbi’ by men” (Matt. 23:6–7). His admonition here is a response to the Pharisees’ proud hearts and their g.asping after marks of status and prestige.

      2. Dear David.

        Even a child, five years old is able to understand Matthew 23:9. My own son, have no problem. Jesus is not speaking about my son, not calling me, his biological father for father. He speaks about the Pope of Rome, or any other religious leader who takes the name of God. «Father» or even worse: «Holy Father».

        Why cant you Catholics just believe what you read, and obey?

        You write pages up on pages to explain that Jesus is a liar. That he is mad, and do not understand that what he says in Matthew 23:9 can never make any sense to you. You hypocritical liars, you white washed tombs. What makes you believe that you can escape the fire of Hell?

      3. You’re the one headed that way, on the surface, by the way you’re prone to judge the hearts of others, Ivar…

        You simply do not understand what Catholics know about scripture. Sacred Scripture forms the whole of Revelation along with Sacred Tradition. Thus, for correct interpretation it is impossible to separate the two or to explain Scripture in such a way that it contradicts Tradition. For as God speaks but one Word, so Sacred Scripture and Tradition, as forms of that one Word, are completely united in one authentic reality. Any interpretation that would find contradiction would be illegitimate, denying the very Truth of God. To ensure this union, the Magisterium is the final authority on all legitimate interpretation.
        Both Catholics and Fundamentalists give a response of faith to the revelation of God. Yet while a Catholic places his faith in God through the Church He founded, a Fundamentalist rests his faith solely in the words of the Bible. The books of the Bible were not written with the intention of being a simple “training manual” for Christians, so this attitude is inadequate. In addition, the object of a Fundamentalist’s faith, in practice, often ends up being his specific pastor’s interpretation of the Scriptures. Thus, while Catholics have faith in the Magisterium for a proper explanation of the Bible, Fundamentalists’ “obedience of faith” is in whichever pastor seems to explain the Scriptures the best. This is not the “assenting to the truth” that Dei Verbum extols.

  8. Hey Ivar,

    Glad to see our Holy Father in Heaven woke you up this morning also.

    I have to let it stand what I wrote, but thank you for the opportunity of letting me write it.

    God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      Who are the people who will say «Lord, Lord», but still will end up in Hell? Just read Matthew 7: 21-23 all over again. I guess they all claimed they «believed» in Jesus, but was taken for a ride with a copy-cat claiming to be him.

  9. You know Ivar, I really do not care anymore. I did not come against you on anything, again all I did was quote what the Bible said. I got it nowhere from any Catholic anything, nor have I ever given anything that has been Catholic to you, as I know how much you hate us and the Church. I have never called you a name.

    If you want to send me to hell, send me there. You have no control over my soul whatsoever. Believe it or not you are not God that can damn me to hell, or let me in heaven.

    I will say it again. Anytime you post something anywhere against things anyone believes in no matter what it is, you can expect some other views on it. If you agree with them or not. Everytime or at least for me anyways, I post something straight out of the Word to you, then I am going to hell.

    I have said it before and will say it again. Your passion and love for God cannot be beaten. I wish you could find somewhere in your heart to channel that for the good of others, instead of the good of your beliefs, and the damning of souls who do not belong to you. You use Scripture to hurt people with and tear them down and send them to hell. That is not why Scripture was given to us. Most of all it teaches love. A love so great we will never come close to having it, and that is the love of God. I do not feel like letting you think you can take that away from me anymore.

    Good luck Ivar. There was something about you I truly liked. I still like you, but I will not stand and let you pronounce the final judgment on my soul, because you can’t.

    I wish you and your family the very best, and pray God blesses all of you. Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      I really like your comments. Seriously. Its not the Church that will save us, but our not corrupt faith in the Word of God. Jesus warned us about Hypocrites. He never gave them «goody, goody, goody». He told them the truth. He told them they were brood of wipers, and children of the devil. Thats how he loved them.

      Who are the Hypocrites, my dear sister? Those who either defends lies, or those who do not practice what they preach. Do not end up with them, whatever you do. Because slowly you will become like them.

      1. You wrote: «I know how much you hate us and the Church».

        Dear Sandy.

        Half of my family are Roman Catholics. How can I hate them? My job is to tell them the truth. Let them cry, or pull all the hair off their head. Its better for them to enter Heaven bald and beautiful, than to perish in a corrupt religious system.

        The good news, is that a lot of Catholics do listen, and starts to obey the Word of God. Those who, do not want to listen….

  10. Ivar, the thing of it is, is that even though Jesus said and did these things, that was not the total love of Jesus so to speak. The love of Jesus went and had Himself, beaten, spit on, thorns tearing in His flesh, Nails in His hands and hung on the Cross as an animal being lead to the slaughter. That is the love of Jesus. The only sin He had on Him was ours, that is was seperates us from being as Jesus. When Jesus condmened man, the love He had for them, went to the Cross. We cannot do that.

    When we get out here and do the same things, we cannot be like Jesus, because we are all sinners. When another sinner starts this name calling, calling people sinners, etc.. the other people they are telling it to are not going to receive it. The reason is, is because somewhere in that day he/she has sinned himself/herself and had to go down on their knees also and ask for forgiveness. Jesus did not have to do that.

    Paul taught and Peter taught. But if you will see Paul’s writings, Paul was always giving thanks for being among those who he was teaching. You have to remember he taught people who did not even believe in God. He taught them, but they knew he loved them. That is how as Christians in my life we need to be. We teach but we love as only a human can love, as none of us has the love of Christ for another human being, because we are not Jesus.

    Like the Veronica thing and the 2 “whatever book it was” I learned something from you about the story of Veronica. There was some pretty unkind things said about Catholics regarding that book. I did not get out here and call you what was it, “a White washed tomb, or something, and tell you were going to hell. To tell you the truth I ignored it. The Veronica story I did not.

    Anything I give to you comes from the Bible and I always try and piece it together for you. If you want to believe it great if not that is up to you. I may have but I do not even think I have ever asked you what Church you went to, because I do not care.
    I know you love God and that is all that matters to me. The difference in beliefs I could care less about. My thing is I want God to be happy with all of us and we get along and represent Him well. I have never tried to make you a Catholic or leave the Church you are in, whatever that Church is. The reason being is, is because this is the place you feel God has lead you to worship and who the hell am I to come against that???

    I do not know Ivar. I thought we could teach and be adult about it, and learn. You have taught me two things since I have been on your blog. One was the “witch did not raise Samuel” and the other was about Veronica. I wanted to do the same for you. I do not read Scripture one verse at a time, I go for the overall as you can see in my post. I do this because there is a plan of God among them. To me we cannot get out here and take one Scripture and beat someone on the head with it.

    One other thing. A true Catholic Ivar, you will never convert. That is something I want you to understand because you are so passionate about God and you love Him so much, that trying to pull a true Catholic away from the Church is such a waste of all of your God given gifts. If I ever teach you and you receive anything, I hope it is that.

    I like you Ivar I truly do and this is someone with almost every breath condemns and persecutes the very Church I love and love to worship God in. What is the common ground here between us? The love of God.
    That is what makes me like you, but I cannot and will not give you my soul to pronounce judgment on.

    If you want to learn that is one thing. Just because it goes against what or how you see Scripture or your beliefs, does not make my soul going to hell. I see many things you write that makes me wonder. But I do not tell you you are going to hell for it. I do not call you names. I do not call your Church names. Like I said, I do not even know what Church you go to and do not care.

    If we can find a common ground that is fine. If we can’t, I cannot continure to do this. I do not say you are wrong for your beliefs when I post, I simply post another view. We must as adults leave it up to other adults to decide for themselves which way they want to go with it.

    God Bless, Sandy

    1. 2. Tess: 2:9-1

      The coming of the lawless one will be in accordance with the work of Satan displayed in all kinds of counterfeit miracles, signs and wonders, and in every sort of evil that deceives those who are perishing. They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie.

      Dear Sandy

      Can you put some light to the true understanding of this message from Paul?

  11. I understand what Paul is saying here Ivar, but see I do not believe my Church is evil. Some men in it have been but every Church has evil men in it. If they did not there would be no need for a Church would there? I am not evil, a sinner yes, but a sinner who has been redeemed by the Blood of Christ.

    Ivar, let us just part friends. I am through with it okay. I have five Bibles in my home, I read them all. I know what the Bible says. The Bible never said I had to see it the way you do, or that you have the authority and control over my soul.

    Chalk it up to this is “one” Catholic you lost okay. The reason is, is because you cannot save my soul, Jesus already has.

    Let us be done, and please do not keep sending me things about how I am going to hell, persih, or the evil of my Church. I might be all these things Ivar, but it is between God and I not you.

    Please just respect my faith if nothing else and love of God, and let it be. I am Catholic, a true Catholic. You will never pull me out of it. The only one who will do that is God if He ever wants me to leave I will know.

    Ivar, you have to start trusting God a little for these things. God is going to work all of this out trust me. I trust that He will.

    Take care and God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      I will not trouble you, surely. But keep on reflecting on a couple of questions:

      In many verses, Paul tells us that there must be two Churches.

      Where do we find the Church of the man of lawnessness?

      And even if we know the truth about Jesus, what will happen to us if we keep on supporting such a religious system?

      Listening to what Jesus says, and even believing that He is the Messiah, even the devil do that.

      But doing the gospel, and even exposing wicked men and their evil dead of darkness, who does that? Jesus did, Paul did, and you are called to to the same.

      1. Are you trying to say that what Paul may have said (I’d like to know where he said it…)overrides what Jesus said “Upon this rock I build my church…” ? One Church. The One, Holy, Catholic (universal) and Apostolic Church…

    2. David, I’m quite sure that Jesus didn’t mean there was to be only one church, The One, Holy, Catholic church. Jesus spoke to John of Patmos about the seven churches of Christ, and five of them he finds fault with. Even among them, there is one of those churches that he threatens to remove entirely as being a church of Christ, which happens to be the church of Ephesus. The church of Ephesus was the first church started by Peter and Peter was martyred in Ephesus. Because that church has not done the first works, they have left their first love. The first love for any Christian is Christ. The first work of ANY Christian church is to teach the word of God the way it’s written. Not add any of your own doctrine or special exclusions that certain churches that exist today are guilty of. The deitifying of Mary, bowing to idols, putting men in charge of forgiving sin, purgatory are all things either not written or expressly written against in the Bible. The church of Ephesus is the Catholic Church, and the False Prophet will be the last Pope, as is predicted by St. Malachy himself. When the last Pope comes and betrays the faith, the Catholic Church will be removed as being a church of Christ and will become the synagogue of Satan.

      1. Dear Jesse.

        Welcome to this site.

        Just like David, you are free to express your views on faith without filters and my sensor at this site. May the God of Israel bless you. In the name of Y´shua. Amen.

      2. Jesse, in the Gospel of Matthew 16:18 Jesus changed Simon bar Jonah’s name (what’s the significance of that??? Whenever God changes someone’s name, he has a new purpose for him…) to Peter and declares that on him, he will build his church. One church.
        Also, he stated in that same passage that the gates of hell would not prevail against his church, so your particular interpretation of the church of Ephesus being the Catholic Church is in error. The churches in Revelation were all part of the one church, but had all erred in some way.
        Some problems with the rest of your statements…
        Peter was martyred in Rome, we have his bones. They were found there.
        We do not deify Mary, we could not possibly, becasue you cannot elevate a human being to god status. We honor Mary as the mother of God. We don’t bow down to idols, either. An idol is something a human being proclaims to be a god. If you’re referring to the statues in our churches, they are reminders of those who honored God, people (note: a human cannot bea god) we honor, our hall of fame. We also don’t let men forgive sin. Only God forgives sin. He uses some men as his instruments to do that. Purgatory as a concept is certainly in the Bible, both in Maccabees and in 1 Corinthians.

        Finally, the Bible itself does not claim to be the sole source of our faith. For the first 80 or so years after Jesus’ death and resurrection, there was no agreed-upon canon of scripture. This was decided by…the Catholic Church…That same Scripture tells us (Gospel of John) that these are only some of the works of Jesus, that if we were to write everything, libraries could not contain all he did. Paul tells Timothy to carry on sacred Tradition.

        You probably also want to say that Jesus did not mean what he said in the Bread of Life discourse (John 6)
        We simply believe that Jesus meant what he said, in the context he said it, with no pretext.

      3. Dear David

        You are off the mark.

        Your comment:

        Finally, the Bible itself does not claim to be the sole source of our faith. For the first 80 or so years after Jesus’ death and resurrection, there was no agreed-upon canon of scripture. This was decided by…the Catholic Church.

        My reply.

        What you are trying to explain to us, is that the Hebrew Canon is not the Bible. Only the Catholic canon is the Bible. Its like saying that Jesus did not have authority to read from the Jewish scriptures, like the book of Genesis, Exodus, Deuteronomy, Isaiah. Daniel and Jeremiah, because he had not taken prior permission from the Pope of Rome.

        David. You have been deceived by a lying Spirit. You simply refuse to listen. Will there ever be any fruits of your commenting on this site? Because so fare, you have not be willing to accept the truth. Whatever we are going to explain to you, I guess it will have no impact.

        Jesus did not come to change a single letter of the Jewish scripture. The New testament is a fulfillment of the Jewish Tanakh and Torah. The Catholic cannon, that does not acknowledge the Jewish canon, have only managed to give the Catholics a corrupted version of the truth.

      4. Dear Jesse and David:

        Daniel 11:36-37:

        The king will do as he pleases. He will exalt and magnify himself above every god and will say unheard-of things against the God of gods. He will be successful until the time of wrath is completed, for what has been determined must take place. He will show no regard for the gods of his fathers or for the one desired by women, nor will he regard any god, but will exalt himself above them all.

        The «king» that will come, will set Him self above God of the Bible. «above them all».

        The Book of Revelation explains that the last war on Earth will be against the Word. A perverted form of Christianity who twist, falsify or deny the Holy Bible will prevail, and billions of people will be deceived.

        Revelation 17:14
        They will make war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will overcome them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.

      5. Hebrew Canon was not even finalized until about 100 AD. The only certainty, from about 200 BC, was the Torah. The other books existed, but were not declared canonical. This is why we have books like the Macabees, Sirach, Baruch, the Esdras, etc.

        Catholic Canon came before Jewish Canon. While the Septuagint, which we accept as the Old Testament was collected and transcribed by 1st century BC, Jews did not accept it as canonical. The first reference to a 24-book Jewish canon is found in 2 Esdras 14:45-46, which was probably written in the first half of the second century AD:

        Make public the twenty-four books that you wrote first, and let the worthy and the unworthy read them; but keep the seventy that were written last, in order to give them to the wise among your people.

        Catholic Canon does recognize Jewish Canon, and then some.

        Ivar, good luck with that…

      6. Dear David.

        You wrote:

        Hebrew Canon was not even finalized until about 100 AD.

        My comment:

        You just accused my Master Jesus of Nazareth for being a «freelancer». Canon means authorized law or scripture. Surely, God had «canonized» his Word, when the Jews wrote down what He told them. Jesus read from the Hebrew Canon in the synagogues. Jesus did not need the Pope to approve him reading from the Book of Isaiah.

        You wrote:

        Catholic Canon came before Jewish Canon

        My comment:

        Do you really believe what you just wrote, the lies the Papal system has told you? Did God really waited up to 397 A.D before anybody was authorized by God our Father to explain who He is?

        The truth is that the Catholic Canon makes a mockery our of the Hebrew Canon. Because the Pope of Rome has included books that are not included in the Hebrew canon, because these books among other errors, promotes witchcraft and a Messiah that will die at the end of the age.

      7. Sorry you cannot handle the truth, Ivar. I didn’t say there were not scriptures. Canon is a defined set of scriptures. It’s how we know that a book is official.

        Jesus wasn’t a free lancer, I never said any such thing.

        You need to know what words mean before you try to refute them. Also you need to review history. This might help:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_of_the_Jewish_Bible_canon

        If the Roman Canon makes a mockery of the Hebrew Canon, why was it considered “canon” at all for 1500 years and more? I’ve already proven your quotations of Sirach false. And if Jesus quoted the deuterocanonical books, how could they be false???

      8. Dear David.

        Shalom.

        You wrote:

        Canon is a defined set of scriptures. It’s how we know that a book is official.

        My comment:

        Since Jesus quoted from the book of Jewish scriptures of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Danial and Psalms, I do not need a Catholic Bishop or the Pope to make these books «official». Neither does any Jew. That the Catholic Church has corrupted the scriptures by admitting, promoting and up till this day defending non-Jewish canon books make the Papal system the system of lawlessness.

        David. You are a part of the pagan defense of witchcraft and anti-Messiahs trying to claim this is «Holy». You are a religious man who do not know the Messiah. You are carrying lot of man made knowledge, that will do you no good the day you will face judgment for what you are doing.

      9. It is precisely because Jesus quoted from those scriptures that they are part of our canon. The apostles also quoted from them. THEY WERE CATHOLIC, Ivar. Jesus instituted one church on himself, led by his apostles, the first of which was Peter, our first pope. We know which books make up the old testament because most often, Jesus quoted from the LXX. This is what makes up the “Old Testament”. In fact, St. Paul also quotes most often from the LXX, as do the early Church fathers. There’s logic here, Ivar.

        Ivar, stop trying to tell me what I am. You have no idea and no right to do that. You are not my judge, God is my judge.

      10. Dear David.

        Shalom, and thanks for your comment:

        When you misguide us, I will keep on telling who you are. I am not your judge. A judge is a man who pass the final judgment. Only God will do that. But If I do not correct you, I will be held accountable by my Master Jesus of Nazareth, for not telling you the truth.

        That the Apostles were all Catholics, is a like saying that the Norwegian Vikings were from Poland. Who do you think you are, David? From which Bible do you quote? I have told you to give me Bible verses.

        First:

        Catholic is a Word that means «universal». The word Catholic Church means «Universal Church». The word Roman Catholic Church means: «The Roman Universal Church», the Church that was founded in Rome after 315 A.D, when the first Roman Emperor claiming he had embraced a faith in Jesus as the Messiah. To claim that the first Jewish Apostles were «Catholics» is a falsification of history, that falls on its own merits.

        It was Rome who persecuted and killed some of Jewish Apostles. Among them Paul, who was beheaded in Rome. It was Rome who destroyed the temple in 70 A.D. It was Rome than occupied Israel when Jesus walked on Earth. Since Israel was under Roman Occupation, it is Rome who is responsible for the destruction the first Churches, that was all filled up by Jews who believed Jesus was the Messiah.

        Heaven forbid that the Jewish Apostles ever became a part of the «Romanism» that already existed in their present age.

      11. Who do I think I am? I am a faithful follower of Jesus Christ, who founded my faith on His apostle Peter. Jesus told Peter and the other apostles to go out and preach His word to all nations. Those apostles were the first bishops. They handed on their faith to the next generation. This next generation is when most of the canon of the New Covenant was written down. They were Catholic. Whic means “universal” or “embracing everyone”.

        Ivar, there is no such thing as the Roman Catholic Church, did you know that? There is the Eastern Rite of the Catholic Church, and the Latin Rite of the Catholic Church. “Roman Catholic Church” is a common label, but completely wrong. The Catholic Church was founded on Jesus Christ and instituted at Pentecost the year he died and rose. It was persecuted for about 300 years, at which time it was legalized. Not founded, legalized. Your view of history is incorrect. You have it right that Romans persecuted the early Catholic Christians, and killed almost all of the apostles. Peter and Paul were both martyred in Rome. But overall, your view of history is very distorted. I’d urge you to open your eyes and your heart and see that your family members who are Catholic are correct. They have the fullness of truth.

  12. I may be called to do the same, but I am not called to rip someone apart in doing it. So let us leave it at that, please.

    God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      I dont know if you will ever come back to this site, but I have a question for you:

      We who do not pray to any saints, but only in the name of Jesus, do we do something wrong?

      If we do something wrong, please explain?

      If we do not do anything wrong why dont you join us?

  13. I wish I could write something so biblically illiterate and make money at the same time like this guy. At my site I’ve heard everything from Rahm Emanuel to some Islamic guy to some Jew as being the Antichrist. The only point I agree with him on from your contentions is about Babylon, but nowhere does it say that Antichrist will come from Babylon anyway. I also believe that Babylon as is written in Revelation and Jeremiah 51 isn’t the same Babylon in old times. Can you look to Baghdad, which is the old Babylon, and see how other countries were made rich from it? The only possibility would have to do with oil, but I’m not buying it. As is written in Daniel, the Antichrist will come from the eleventh nation to join the revived Roman Empire. The fourth kingdom goes away, but then its reformation is described. If anything fits in with the old Roman Empire today, it’s the European Union. The eleventh nation was either Spain or Portugal since they came in at the same time. Babylon certainly doesn’t fit there.The EU doesn’t really have a capital, but has a couple of cities where they base most of their operations, one of them being Madrid. Either way, the Antichrist will come from Europe. Not any Muslim country. His book is folly.

    1. Dear Jesse.

      The Bible is not mentioning the name of the specific nations, from where the antichrist will raise and come. Many nations have come, and many nations have gone.

      But one thing is for sure. He will come to Jerusalem, and He will be worshiped as God. He will come first, than the true Messiah will return and kill him. Jerusalem will be the final battle zone between good and evil, the truth and lies, right and wrong.

      The city of Jerusalem has lasted for 3.000 years. At the end the New Heavenly Jerusalem will come. We all have some awesome moments ahead of us.

  14. You are right Ivar no offense to you. I am not coming back unless you can show some discipline about telling me I am always going to hell and calling Catholics names, and you apologize for doing so.

    I am not going to respond to any questions. Please feel free to stop by my blog now and then and let me know how you are doing.

    Keeping you and yours in my prayers. God Bless, Sandy

    1. Dear Sandy.

      Shalom.

      You are loved by Jesus, and I pray you will never end up in Hell. There is hopefully a lot of time left on Earth for both of us. But we have to live like this is our last day, to be ready to face Him at any moment. The rapture might take place at 3 pm. today. Non of us had any guaranty last evening, that he would wake us up in the morning.

  15. God CURSED His creation? What a joke!

    So the God you believe in is “evil” and “violent.” First he curses His own creation then he chooses to violently kill his son a most severe death! Amazing!

    You must think God in Heaven is sort of an old man who is your equal. He “came down himself?” Completely human? This is an ungodly characterization for God the Creator simply says: “Be” and it “is.” He, in His Glory, does NOT need to “bow” down to His creation and place “Himself” on a cross then cry to… Himself Eli, Eli, lama sabachtani..

    Born a Jew? So why are there Christians in this world? Why do Jews refuse him and claim that he is in Hell boiling in human excrement?

    Your religion is so contradictory! No wonder Islam was the fastest growing religion in the U.S. after 9/11!!!

    Compare that to the God of Muslims as stated in the Quran – which you know nothing aboutt:

    Just a few verses!

    112 SAY: “He is the One God: “God the Eternal, the Uncaused Cause of All Being. “He begets not, and neither is He begotten; “and there is nothing that could be compared with Him.

    2:255 God(Allah). There is no god but He,-the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permitteth? He knoweth what (appeareth to His creatures as) before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth. His Throne doth extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feeleth no fatigue in guarding and preserving them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory).

    59:23 God (Allah) is He, than Whom there is no other god;- the Sovereign, the Holy One, the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the Supreme: Glory to Allah. (High is He) above the partners they attribute to Him.

    God, in His Love and Mercy for those who follow His commands forgives all sins.. for those who glorify Him, repent and do good. But it seems YOUR god does not differentiate between good people and tyrants.. and therefore, since Hitler was Christian, then he too is “forgiven.”

    You still have not answered the question: why did Jesus (your god) cry out to himself (whatever he left in heaven?) Does god pray to another god?

    You just don’t know how to address this, right? That’s because you’re really either a Jew or a Christian Zionist who, deep inside, is not really convinced of this trinity thing!

    ATW

    1. Dear ATW.

      Shalom.

      I have deleted some of your comments, because they were off the mark of our debate. This one i have permitted, because you ask relevant questions:

      You asked:

      You still have not answered the question: why did Jesus (your god) cry out to himself (whatever he left in heaven?) Does god pray to another god?

      My replay:

      Jesus the Son of man was completely human when He walked on Earth. He was baptized at the age of 30, and anointed with God the Holy Spirit . When he died on the cross, He spoke to His Father in Heaven. Jesus was always in perfect agreement with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit.

      Why did Jesus cry out to His Father in Heaven, since He should be aware of his resurrection after three days?

      At that very moment, Jesus bore the sins of the whole World, exposed to all evil from the beginning of the Word, to the end off all ages. You can be sure that was not an easy burden. Jesus the Son of Man, the complete Human, had not proven His divinity by being raised from the death. Even his most faithful students had failed to believe in Him. That changed three days later.

      The complete Human Jesus from Nazareth shows us his humanity at the cross. He cried, just like me and you. Not because of some sins, bur for the lies, wickedness, violence, injustice, pollution, idol worship and mocking of our Father in Heaven, committed by every single human being that have ever existed, does exist, and will come into existence till the day of His return.

      No one else have done this, and no one can do this but God the Son. Thats why Jesus could say: «The Father and I are One».

      1. Ivar,

        Deleting some of my comments because you decide they were “off the mark” is despicable and proves that you seek nothing more than to cause havoc.

        You are quite selective in your responses; it’s as if you wait to receive answers from some other uneducated source! Regardless, your responses are getting weaker and more superficial.

        Talk about a confused person (or religion): you don’t seem to be decisive about Jesus’ nature: you mention he’s God, then he’s a son of God then he’s Man? Which is it? How could God who, Glory be to Him, is Infinite become “finite” and brings himself through the womb of his creation? Absurd, isn’t it?

        Again, no wonder Islam is the fastest growing religion in the U.S. after 9/11 as people searched for the truth and found it in Islam. No wonder so many priests who have converted to Islam always stated that the biggest troubling thing they faced (in Christianity) was this thing called Trinity!

        So let me make it easy for you:

        1. Is Jesus God or Man? Was He created?
        2. Where did he say that he is God in the Bible?
        3. What about John 14:28?
        4. Where does he say that he is the son of God in the Bible?
        5. Do you have your supporting “evidence” in the original form – not the poorly translated English version that so many decided to rewrite yet claim it to be the word of God?
        6. Where does the Bible say that Trinity exists?

        ATW

      2. Dear ATW

        Thanks for a good an reflective comment. If you continue this way, I will not have to delete any of your comments.

        You wrote:

        Again, no wonder Islam is the fastest growing religion in the U.S. after 9/11, as people searched for the truth and found it in Islam.

        My comment:

        This is the most bizarre statement I have ever read. And I have read a lot. All the suicide bombers that murdered almost 2.000 people, the large majority of them American, were all citizens of the Islamic Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. When they slammed into the twin towers, they believed they were doing something great for Allah. Even killing other Muslim brothers who were at work in New York city that day.

        Dear ATW.

        If you are ever doing to avoid the flames of Hell, you have to take a look in the mirror, and see the demon that have taken you for a ride. You are a wicked man, full of lies and hate. You need to repent, and change your ways. Behold Jesus the Messiah is willing to forgive your sins, if you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart that He is risen from the death.

      3. Igor,

        Your strong “Christian-Zionist-hatred” and ignorance are simply amazing! You are no different than the Jews who rejected Jesus or the pagans of olden days rejecting Abraham, Noah and even Muhammad, peace be upon them all.

        Your ignorance of the facts of 911 are mind boggling! After all this time, it was proven that the so-called Saudis were alive and well after the announced list of hijackers. http://1933key.com/9-11-Conspiracy/9-11-Suicide-Hijackers-Found-Alive

        That alone confirms the theory that this was an inside job with the Zionist pigs you care for so much.

        Under the guise of religion, you try to come across as a “loving objective” Christian or Jew, yet you fail miserably; your anti-Semitic comments (yes buddy, if you don’t know this fact, then I’m simply dealing with a kid here) against Arab Muslims are despicable.

        EVEN IF the terrorists were all Muslim as you would like to believe, then does this make the religion guilty? If so, then Christianity AND Judaism are Nazism. Period. This would be the reasoning if I were to apply your twisted logic since the KKK (a Christian fellowship) or Zionism, which really is NaZionism, are committing murders and massacres till this day in the name of religion or the twisted “God’s chosen” garbage!

        So dear Igor, get the fact and grow up. I suspect that your a young pup since this is exactly the image you portray.

        As for looking in the mirror, you really should practice what you preach. For the demon in within you and you had proven this simple fact yourself!

        Basque in your idiotic beliefs… you’re a waste of my time!

        ATW

      4. Dear ATW.

        Shalom.

        You wrote:

        That alone confirms the theory that this was an inside job with the Zionist pigs you care for so much.

        My reply:

        We have earlier agreed that God if love. But your message is again full of hate. Since you are full of hate, Allah will not let you into the Kingdom of Heaven. First when you make a u-turn, and start blessing people, we can speak about how you can get saved from the flames of Hell.

      5. Dear ATW.

        Shabbat Shalom. Thanks for challenging me on my knowledge of the Bible. You questions have numbers:

        1. Is Jesus God or Man? Was He created?

        Jesus is both God the Son and Man. He was God the Son in Heaven, came to Earth to save is in form of a Man (in flash), and went back to Heaven where He is God the Son.

        2. Where did he say that he is God in the Bible?

        John 8:58
        “I tell you the truth,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!”

        John 4:24-26:

        The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.”

        Then Jesus declared, “I who speak to you am he.”

        John 10:17

        The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again.

        John 20:28

        Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”

        3. What about John 14:28?

        “You heard me say, ‘I am going away and I am coming back to you.’ If you loved me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.

        Jesus spokes this words as a Man, completely human. In Heaven, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit is always in agreement. God the Father speaks, God the Son does, and God the Holy Spirits reminds us about the truth, and tells us about things to come.

        4. Where does he say that he is the son of God in the Bible?

        Jesus multiple times says that He has come to display the likeness of His Father God, do do the will of His Father God.

        John 8:28

        So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am the one I claim to be and that I do nothing on my own but speak just what the Father has taught me.

        John 8:38
        I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you do what you have heard from your father. ”

        5. Do you have your supporting “evidence” in the original form – not the poorly translated English version that so many decided to rewrite yet claim it to be the word of God?

        You can read these verses in Hebrew is you like.

        6. Where does the Bible say that Trinity exists?

        Luke 3:22
        and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: “You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased.”

        Now, here you can read about the trinity. Father God spoke from Heaven. God the Holy Spirit can down on Jesus, who is approved from Heaven to be the divine God the Son.

        Genesis 1:1 also speaks about Father God telling «let us make« He speaks in plural. If Allah is alone up there, not having a Son, the Bible is a complete falsehood.

      6. Ivar,

        Once again, you change the words and give the same uneducated answers. I had much more meaningful and intelligent debates with some Christian friends. You have a lot to learn.

        1. Restating the point without answering is not an answer.

        2. This is nonsense! 😉 Give me something CONCRETE! Better yet, don’t bother since you know nothing and use TRANSLATED versions of the Bible to respond? Learn Aramaic and/or hebrew first!

        Then Jesus declared, “I who speak to you am he.”

        Really? You should learn English! So when someone calls my name, say and says: Are you ATW? My response would also be: :I who speak to you am he.”

        Oy Vey!

        3. You JUST STATED he was a Man! So God is a Threesome now? Glorified be His name!

        4. John 8:28 and 8:38 do not prove this claim!

        So Jesus said, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am the one I claim to be and that I do nothing on my own but speak just what the Father has taught me.

        John 8:38
        I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you do what you have heard from your father. ”

        Poorly translated and does not say that he is God anything: son or man! The word father by the way, in Aramaic and Hebrew and even Arabic is used to show RESPECT and admiration and not that he was a father as in human terms. And you don’t know this?

        5. Oh I did 🙂 But it seems you know nothing of the sort!

        6. Yes, correct, TODAY’s Bible is a Complete Falsehood. It was written by men who “thought it was a good idea to also write about Jesus.” Now do you know who I’m talking about here?

        Don’t even bother answering.. I’m through reading your ignorant replies!

        On the Day of Judgment, God Almighty will JUDGE you and ME! I hope that You will KNOW who I am and that I would know who you are! On that day, the Angels will be dragging all those who believed in other gods besides God, to Hell. Will you be amongst them? I dare say YES if you maintain this ignorance.

        See you on Judgment Day!

        ATW

      7. Dear ATW.

        Shalom.

        You wrote:

        Don’t even bother answering.. I’m through reading your ignorant replies!

        My reply:

        If you are only interested in listening to your own arguments, you would write a message like this.

  16. Attendingtheworld: I note that 2 of allah’s beautiful names are “Destroyer” and “Deceiver”. In the Bible, these are names for Satan.

    Have you ever read the Bible? I challenge you to do so.

    1. Dear Siridh.

      Thanks for your love for ATW. We need to keep him in prayer. He needs to surrender and come to the cross of Jesus the Messiah. The most loving and caring Jew that ever walked on Earth also shed His blood for the sins of every Muslim. The Messiah is alive!

  17. “The Quran says about Jews and Christens”,
    I want to tell the truth. This message specially Jews and Christens and the whole human kind.
    “Quran” the Islamic holy book is the last revelation from our God Almighty. This is my challenge to all human kind read only once this book you will have to believe it that really this book is from God revelation. Please brothers and sisters don’t get angry or spread hatred between each other’s.
    I got very much sad when I see this verse of Islamic holy book “Quran” God Almighty says to
    “JEWS” in one place,
    ” O, Children Of Israel,, I gave you the superiority in the whole world did you forget that?.”
    And in other verse of Quran “God Almighty” says again to “JEWS”
    “O Children of “ISRAEL”, why you people do not believe and total faith in your own holy revelation book “TORAH”. Why you have been changing the verse of “TORAH”.
    In several places of Islamic holy book Quran tells us about “JEWS” and “Christens”.
    Please get Islamic Holy book “Quran” to day. I am sure you will get satisfaction after read all the “Quran”. I am not forcing any one to do this but please get once only once and see what happens.
    My English is not well; I want to excuse for all speakers of “ENGLISH”.

    Thank You

    1. Dear Saifulislam

      Shalom, and welcome to this site.

      All the blessings that man can get have come out from the Jewish People. It is all fulfilled in the Messiah, Jesus from Nazareth. I am in debt to the Jewish people. I have to return all the blessings. The least thing I can do is to trade with them, and support their right to the Jewish homeland.

  18. Muslims are not enemies of Jews and Christians.
    Jews, Christians, Muslims are very much closer by their religion.
    Why the Jews and Christians makes friendship with “HINDUS” the Idol worshipers. Did the Judaism or Christianity tell them to do it?
    We all Jews, Christians and Muslims are the believers of revelations book of
    Almighty God. Although if we do not agreed each other’s beliefs. After all we Muslims are closer with Jews and Christians. Because this is the compulsory part of Islam that we have to faith on the holy prophet of God
    “JESUS peace be upon him “,
    “MOSES peace be upon him”,
    “DAVID peace be upon him”,
    “ABRAHAM peace be upon him”,
    “Arabic name an Israeli holy prophet YUSUF peace be upon him”,
    “SULEMAN peace be upon him”,
    We all Muslims believe and faith on those prophets who came to the ISRAEL. This is one of the pillars of Islam to accept all those Prophets. We Muslims believe that the prophets came to the world not to divinity. They were holiest prophets of God.
    We Muslims believe that,
    God has given “MOSES” the Ten Commandments, and holy book of “Torah”.
    We believe that Jesus was born miraculously without any male interference.
    We believe, before the existence of the world God’s chair was on the water.
    We all Muslims believe that Moses peace be upon him talked with God Almighty in this world.
    We believe that Jesus was life put to death. And he healed the different kind of diseases. We believe Jesus peace be upon him was talking about the secrets of people which came to him.
    We believe Moses also came the nation of Israel and he saved the nation from “PHERON”(the Egyptian king) who was putting death sentence to the Israeli children’s.
    Moses peace be upon him saved the nation of Israel in several times by the grace God. We Muslims believe that Christ will come again.
    But, the different between Islam Judaism and Christianity is,,
    THE JESUS WILL COME BACK TO WORLD. HE IS IN HEAVEN NOW, WHEN HE WILL COME BACK, HE WILL TELL THE WHOLE HUMAN KIND ABOUT THE WORSHIP ONLY ONE GOD.
    PLEASE READ COMPLETELY THE ISLAMIC HOLY BOOK ” QURAN ” YOU WILL FIND THE SAME VESRSES LIKE IN JEWISH HOLY BOOK “TORAH” AND CHRISTANS HOLY BOOK “BIBLE”.
    PLEASE MUST READ THE QURAN.
    Good Bye

  19. This world is mortal.
    The universe is mortal.
    And the time is very near the universe is going to the end soon.
    It will completely destroy not bye from God Almighty.
    It will have done from the human being.
    Every body know about increasing of the global warming and when we see in that case the ultraviolet rays comes from sun to the earth without scanning.
    Who is responsible for all this?
    Yes we human are responsible for all this.
    The God almighty wrote all creators fat before several thousand years ago of their birth. And now what we human are doing. We are interfering of the things that are created God Almighty. And what we made we made Atomic Bombs to destroy each other’s.
    Why we cannot control our anger?
    The time is running out.
    Good bye

  20. All we have to remember is that throughout the Bible, Koran and the Torah the Elite have always been the evil doers and the poor the righteous. And like in the times of the Bible the rich ensured that they scweded thing to make them look good but history will tell. And when I hear idiots saying that America was built of Chrsitian beliefs…let me see what where they refering too….GENOCIDE????SLAVERY????CROOKERY>>>> and little do they realize their founding father where all atheist…which is why they seperated church from religion…which is why Jefferson and Wasthington didn’t use the Bible cause they didn’t believe in it. There is a difference with claiming you’re a Chrsitian and actually being one. Most of us are not unfortunately

    1. Dear Giovani.

      Shalom, and welcome to this site.

      You wrote:

      All we have to remember is that throughout the Bible, Koran and the Torah the Elite have always been the evil doers and the poor the righteous.

      My comment:

      This is a half-truth. There are righteous people in the Bible that are rich, and there are sinners that are poor. And visa versa. People can have become poor because they have gambled away their money, used it on sex, drugs and rock & roll. God of the Bible does not look to our outward appearances, our gold and silver. He looks to the heart. Have you opened your heart to Jesus, or have you not.

  21. ok.

    1. Do not buy that stupid book Joel Richardson is an anti-christ. Money hungry, deceiving, anti-christ.

    2. SAY: “O disbelievers!
    I do not serve what you serve
    nor are you serving what I serve!
    I will not worship what you have worshipped,
    neither will you worship what I worship.
    You have your religion
    while I have my religion. -Quran

    If you are so faithful, disbelievers why don’t you keep your mouth shut and be satisfied with what you believe in; if indeed you are so faithful and righteous. Only time will tell, you are in control of your life make sure you make the right choice, I guarantee you this will not be easy.

  22. Incredible. I had never seen a debate like this.
    When you say “the Catholics”, “the Jews”, “the Muslim”, shouldn’t you quote the sources?

    Otherwise it looks like you are talking about the sock puppets of your imagination.

    For Catholic teaching for instance you might quote some encyclical. They are all available online.

  23. I Have not read Richardson’s book, but I have done extensive research into the theory. First, the Antichrist is not just theorized to be the 12th Imam (which is to believed by Shi-ite Muslims to be the Mahdi born in 872 A.D. and supernaturally kept alive under a Mosque), but simply the Muslim leader called “the Mahdi” which all of Islam does believe in (by both Shi-ite, Sunni and common Muslims). The Mahdi is the leader who will come to spread Islam across the world by force and rein for 7 years in which he will make a 7 year peace treaty. Shortly after his appearance, Muslim Jesus (Isa) will “come back” and be submissive to the Mahdi and instruct the world to follow the Mahdi. Muslim Jesus (Isa) will tell Christians and Jews that they were wrong to follow him as the son of God, as he is simply a prophet and they have no salvation in him. Many Christians and Jews are prophesied in Islam to turn from their previous faith and become Muslim. Any resistance to Islam will be met with death by beheading. Does this at all sound familiar? It seems that the Mahdi has many descriptors of the Biblical Anti-Christ and Muslim Jesus (Isa) has many attributes of the Biblical False Prophet, many of which I have not mentioned here. I encourage you to do your own research, especially regarding 666 and Islam (The Greek written characters for 666 in the Bible are nearly identical to the Arabic characters “In the name of – Allah – Islam Nations/Islam swords. This quote is worn on the foreheads and right arms of militant Muslims today as a badge of allegiance.)

    So one may be confused because Biblical scholars have been saying for years that the Anti-Christ will emerge from the “revived Roman Empire” which many believe to be modern Western Europe or the U.S. What most fail to see is that the Roman empire had an Eastern leg which lasted until 1453 when it was overrun with Muslims. This Eastern leg of the Roman Empire is modern day, Iraq, Syria, Turkey, Israel, Lebanon, Jordan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia and parts of Saudi Arabia. Each of these are rising Islam nations. So the Biblical texts not only supports the Anti-Christ emerging from this Middle East region (which was part of the Roman Empire), it explicitly states it in many passages in Micah, Issiah, Thessalonians, Ezekiel, Hosea and Malachi. Although this is just one example, if you read the context of the following verse below (Micah 5), it is describing the coming of Jesus and how He will be the Savior of Israel in the end times when “the Assyrian” invades Israel. The old kingdom of Assyria overlaps the Roman Empire in Iraq, Syria, and Turkey and also encompasses Israel, Lebanon, Jordon and a parts of Iran, Egypt and Saudi Arabia. This would locate the Anti-Christ from one of these regions. Here is just one Biblical example:

    “When the Assyrian comes into our land (of Israel), And when he treads in our palaces, Then we will raise against him Seven shepherds and eight princely men. They shall waste with the sword the land of Assyria (Modern day Iraq, Iran, Syria, Turkey and parts of Saudi Arabia), And the land of Nimrod (Iraq) at its entrances; Thus He (Jesus) shall deliver us from the Assyrian, When he comes into our land And when he treads within our borders.” -Micah 5:5-6.

    So this is a warning to Christians and the world, that anyone who comes claiming that Jesus is not the Son of God is a false prophet. I would be leery not to discount an Islamic Anti-Christ, as much of the descriptions of the Maudi and Muslim Jesus (Isa) fall into place perfectly with the Bible’s Anti-Christ and false prophet. I leave you with this verse of warning from Jesus himself: “At that time if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Messiah!’ or, ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you ahead of time.” -Matthew 24:23-25

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